Wednesday, October 03, 2007

A Mall and The Night Visitors

I've been wary of writing this blog, but I've decided to go ahead.

See what you all think.

Sometimes I'm catty, immature, silly and even mean.

And sometimes I enjoy being all of those things.

It's like being a teen girl on testosterone.

Anyways, Joe and I were going through the mall and I spotted a woman who was wearing clothes two sizes too small and twenty years too young. Her hair was two-toned and her jewellery garish like she bought it from the 'so you want to look like a whore' hour on the shopping network. She practically begged for comment, so I did. Just to Joe, of course, being heard by none other. We giggled as we then began editorializing on other people's manner, dress, hygiene. It was just plain fun.

To spend a few minutes being impolite was a bit freeing. Spending a lifetime trying to be understanding and kind is great but it's also wearing. I can't believe, I'm telling you this. But somehow I don't think I'm alone. I think it's probably hard wired into the psyche to comment on someone wearing turquoise who should be wearing black. I mean don't people have mirrors. It's make up not paint. As a fat guy, I upholster myself carefully. I don't want muffin tops over my pants and I don't want any part of me exposed without intent. Geez, get a grip, thongs look wrong on almost everyone.

Then I saw the ultimate guy. Flannel red pajama bottoms, beer gut hanging over, tank top way too tight. I made an unkind comment. Joe went, "Shhhhh...."

"No one can hear me," I said.

"He's got a disability," Joe said.

And I immediately stopped.

That interchange has bothered me ever since. I mean I wasn't joking about his disability, I was joking about his clothes. I wasn't more unkind with him than I'd been with "Flip Flop Mama" or the "King of Comb Over". But still I stopped.

Like his disability somehow exempted him from the kind of casual scrutiny of a stranger. Like he had to be treated as more fragile, more special than everyone else. Held to a different standard. And a lower one indeed.

It's weird but I feel now that my prejudice was shown more by stopping than it would have been if I had continued and treated him to my unkind wit like I'd treated everyone else.

Two questions for you. First, do you ever have catty outbursts like we did at the mall? Be honest. Second, would you have stopped too, if you discovered someone had a disability? Now one big one, is stopping the right thing to do?

34 comments:

Defying Gravity said...

I know exactly what you mean... I'm a fat woman and I take great care that what I wear doesn't emphasise the fatness! I think I would have stopped too, but I'm not sure if it's the right thing to do. I guess if his disability has an effect on his dress sense that might be a reason for having different 'standards'...

valleegurll said...

I too enjoy the people watching followed with internal comment on their attire...knowing full well that I could use a "What not to wear" lesson at times myself!
In the organization that I work in there are a number of individuals who attract attention because of their disability...physical appearance or body gestures. I feel it is our role to ensure that the clothing is modern, age appropriate and fit well....floods are not "in"!!! So yes I do stop but only to vent about the support people and their lack of competence!

Belinda said...

Hey Friends,
Yes, I'm catty at times, and I gossip under the guise of commenting seriously on something I intend to follow up on directly with the person--and then I don't always have the guts to do that. But I don't like when it happens because that's not who I want to be in this world.

Whether disability would change my filter of kindness is a complex question. It probably would, sometimes in good ways and sometimes bad. I don't think any of us can claim total equity of interaction. There are so many underlying dynamics.

Going back to my two word philosophy of a few days ago:

Touch gently--I try but fail, often.

I asked one of my friends who didn't see that blog post, what her two words would be. She said:

Love big

Bev said...

This is a great set of questions. I think it is an excellent argument for adjusting the way we (as a society, I mean) view disability. It's something I've given a lot of thought to also, regarding my own tendency to judge. If I want understanding for my social differences as an autistic person, should I not grant that understanding to all, even those who, according to my all encompassing wisdom, really should know better? Of course I know the answer to this one, and that I am being childish when I judge others for these things which, really, don't matter. I mean, maybe Turquoise Mama does have some kind of difference which in some culture or other could be construed as a disability?

I know that when I am tempted to say something petty, I am less likely to do so now that my understanding of some of these issues has increased. That doesn't mean I don't do it, but I stop and think about it first, more often than I used to. It is sometimes difficult to resist that very human urge to find someone even less "with it" than myself, but it is a worthwhile challenge to keep trying.

Thanks for the very thought provoking post.

Ashley's Mom said...

I wrote on this subject a while back myself. The clothing part is about half way down the blog entry:

Don't Love Me Too Much

Do I comment on folks walking through the mall - Yes, especially if I am with someone and we 'share' the silliness. Of course, folks are also probably commenting on me at the same time :)

Would I have stopped if the person had a disability - probably yes, but I would have shifted my comments to the person or people who had offered support and advice along the way to that person with a disability.

Is topping the right thing to do - whoa, hard question. Actually, I shouldn't comment on anyone, disabled or not. Perhaps I can just stop all together...

lina said...

oh Dave, funny and thought provoking - kudos to you - yet again.
Ok, my answers:
Do I have catty outburts? Surprise, surprise - yes I do! sometimes to myself in my own space and others, with other people who have known me too long and share my sense of warped humour (oh how I love those people in my life!).
Would I have stopped? Well, the truth is I would think that I have to stop - but in my head the laughter persists. But I think we are all fair game (I'm sure I have given many people - disabled or not, something to laugh about many a time, with my own poor choices - although I would hope that the shoes always match!).
Is stopping the right thing to do?
Well, yes, for all of my cattiness - towards everyone - but it will likely not stop anytime soon - sorry - but better to be honest no?

Anonymous said...

Can I take your question and move it a bit sideways? On Saturday I went grocery shopping and encountered one of those moments when a complete stranger marchs up and starts asking totally personal and invasive questions (what happened? were you born that way? do you have kids?...) etc. etc. etc. I'm not good at handling this in general - but usually manage a show of humor and get it turned off fairly quickly. This time, I was totally stuck. There was something a bit unidentifiable that told me that she had her own disability and that perhaps those questions were coming from a different place. I still resented the personal prying, but I did my best.

I'm not sure this will make sense to you - but I was, the whole time, thinking about your blog and your experiences. And at the same, I was trying to figure out what made it different, why the rules changed for me. I think I want to be a bit gentler to the folks that tend to get short changed by others? I hope so.

Kei said...

Yes, I whisper comments to my husband (and he to me, which often makes me 'shhhhsh' him coz he's not quite as quiet as he thinks) or to my adult children. I don't know that I've ever stopped after making a comment about someone with a disability, perhaps I just don't remember or maybe even didn't make the comment at all because of it.

And I'm sure my family has been the subject of whispers & shshhhs.. my almost 10 yr old daughter has such a unique sense of style and a flair for the dramatic that we've gotten many looks, and I have even been pulled aside to be told that she makes them smile and how she just exudes confidence. It sometimes makes me wonder if there's an unspoken end to the sentence ..."to be wearing that out in public"
LOL

Casdok said...

I love people watching, but i know first hand what it is like for people to make remarks to your face.
My teenage autistic son is unable to choose what he wears, so i and his staff dress him. I try to be careful what i buy for him. But what do parents know about dressing teenagers!!

Anonymous said...

I have been reading your blogs for a couple of weeks now, it came recommended, a "everyone should be reading this daily" And since I have a 8 year old son with ds I'm suppose to love your insight, but, I'm sorry, I don't, I find you sad.. Not only do I have a son with ds, but I have worked in this field for approx. 15yrs. no, I don't personally have a disability but in more ways than one, we are all broken.....none of us are perfect... Maybe when I was younger late teens early twentys I would act in such judging ways, but I try never to look and critize ANYONE...again, I'm not perfect and when those thoughts come in my head I try to pray for that person and myself to see them differently. The number one thing my son has taught me is that truly you can not judge a person by their "looks" I don't care if they are "disabled" or not... You seem very unhappy to me, maybe I'm just missing something but I don't find you insightful, just sad.........

Anonymous said...

A few weeks ago when I met with one of our ladies she was wearing combat boots, a slinky black skirt, a purple bunny t-shirt and a green combat jacket. I asked her about the clothes and she said she had been on a date and wore what her boyfriend liked...she liked it too. After knowing this woman for almost 20 years I have learned that her goal is never to "blend". People are going to look regardless, why not have fun and give them something to look at is her philosophy. BTW she's just as likely to be catty about a woman in pearls as they might be about her.

Am I a bit catty too. Absolutely!

Jamie

Anonymous said...

I know that in your own time, it shouldn't matter what you wear when you go out, but in a professional capacity, it does. I recently heard of a title that I like very much as it says it all. "Director of First Impressions". This could be for anyone, in any job that meets the public. When you are on work time, you represent the organization you work for and should dress accordingly. If you want to look different when it's your own time, knock your socks off. Go Dolly Parton.

Jo

Anonymous said...

first, to be honest yes I do sometimes make snide comments (either mentally or to my wife) on what people choose to wear.

2nd, i think a person's disability would only stop a potential snide comment if I was pretty sure it had an impact on that person in regard to how they dressed. if their disability doesn't effect dress sense then it's a double standard to refrain from the snide thought/comment.

gosh, way to expose the dirty underbelly of our minds... :)

Anonymous said...

That's thought provoking Dave...

Having had a chat with my husband about this we decided that 1. We do have these cheeky giggles together.

2.No we wouldn't have stopped, safe in the mutual understanding that it was all about the clothes and our funny ways and not the disability and the fact that we don't find disability itself amusing.

3. Ahhh is stopping right? we thought that the reason we would have a giggle like this now and again, is because we have a trust in each other that knows that neither of us have mean intent, both of us would never wish to harm or upset to anyone and both of us do in fact endeavour to live life in a way that is about treating people right and building good relationships .

However if I was to be with someone else, who did not have this intimate understanding of me or of the tone of our giggle, I may well stop, I would not want to run the risk that the other person would misundertand the situation and get from me a message that I thought it was OK to laugh at someone with a disability. In fact, I probably wouldn't find myself even starting.

(We often laugh at each other in this way too).

Anonymous said...

I have talked about the way people dress, I have stopped when realizing that the person has a disability. I have second guessed someone I have commented on, wondering later if that person may have had a disability. Then I feel badly thinking they nay have.

Is it wrong to stop? Maybe. But I tend to think there are so many reasons for people with disabilities to wear clothes that many of us wouldn't. Not enough money. Poor supports as far as family or staff who don't make sure they don't dress in such a manor. Or maybe even there is a sensory issue, and certain clothes simply feel good to them.
I don't know, I do hate having two sets of rules like that, but it is difficult not to in some situations.

Andrea Shettle, MSW said...

To the anonymous person who thinks Dave is "sad" and "not insightful" ... I hope you stick around a while longer and keep reading. Or else, you may want to browse around the archives here. I think you're misinterpreting the tone of this post and perhaps his other posts as well, perhaps because you haven't read long enough (at least from the sound of it) to get a real sense of who Dave is as a person or where he's coming from. I don't pretend to know him well as a person either (never met him in person), but it IS easier to put any one blog post in perspective, or a dozen blog posts, when you're able to compare it against a much broader context of the other things he has said.

By the way, one of the favorite of my articles by Dave is not at this blog -- it's at: http://www.ohiosilc.org/news/threads_v3_n1/2000win3.html ... I encourage you to read that -- that should give you a better sense of what Dave is about and what he is working toward in the disability field (i.e., liberation from institutions and empowerment/self-determination for people with disabilities including people with cognitive impairments).

As for Dave's occasional cattiness -- okay, this may not be his most attractive moment. BUT: it's never (I am very sure) to anyone's face or in a way that they would overhear or be hurt. And it's NOT in the spirit of making fun of people -- it's making fun of their CLOTHING (and maybe their taste). A fine line maybe, but I do think it's one that matters. And I doubt this is a regular habit for him.

To be honest, I think praying for someone on the basis of their appearance is more of a judgment on them than whispering a not-very-nice comment to your partner of 30 years. Praying in that context, to me, seems to assume the person necessarily needs to be changed or helped or "saved" -- i.e., that they're not already fine just the way they are. Whereas I could privately think to myself "I don't like the color of that person's dress" and still be fully supportive of their right to choose that dress if that's what they happen to really like wearing. And I think it's the same for Dave. He isn't judgmental when it matters most.

(Side note: Personally, I probably wouldn't say anything about a person's clothing out loud, even in a whisper or in sign. At most I would think it to myself. And usually I wouldn't do even that, one because I know I have no sense of color coordination myself and I like comfortable clothing so I doubt I look that great all the time myself, and two because I don't really pay attention to clothing so I often don't notice these things in the first place.)

--Andrea
http://wecando.wordpress.com
http://reunifygally.wordpress.com

Anonymous said...

MAke catty comments about attire? Honestly, yes, but usually only mentally and not audibly. In my opinion, wardrobe and appearance are a function of chosen behavior, and as such, up for commentary and even snide witticisms from onlookers.

Refrain from making catty comments if the person is disabled? I would, if the disability in some way keeps the person from having true choice in their appearance /wardrobe -- they've vision impaired, they rely on others to dress them or to purchase clothing for them.

Is it right? Well, it is if this principle is correct-- the behavior (which the person has a choice about) is fair game, but physical characteristics/including disability) about which they do not have a choice are not fair territory for mockery.

Anonymous said...

There are a couple of levels to my response. As someone who supports people with disabilities, I love natural consequences. I can talk forever about matching colors, appropriate fit, etc., but nothing I say will be as powerful as someone in the community making a comment about the way a person is dressed. By NOT commenting, we are just encouraging people with disabilities to continue to dress in ways that prevent or hinder them from truly integrating into their communities. Silence is it's own form of approval.

As a realist, I know that life is often hard, but isn't that what life is all about? Good times, bad times, boring times, sad times... By protecting people with disabilites from "bad things", we are denying them the full life experience to which they are entitled.

So - if you're going to make comments about the way people look, then make sure to include everyone! (But, if I hear you make a comment about a fat, nearly middle-aged redhead who is partial to voluminous, brightly colored shirts, you will be in DEEP trouble!)

Anonymous said...

My catty outbursts are usually directed at Professionals. But I have odd moments.

Would I have stopped? Possibly. Depending partly on the (apparent) disability. Which is possibly more disturbing than to treat all disability as incompatible with (my version of) good taste! (Possibly not. I can think of legitimate reasons, but wouldn't swear they're the only ones.)

Perhaps the reason one *can laugh so freely at others' wince-making taste is that it's least of sins?

ballastexistenz said...

By NOT commenting, we are just encouraging people with disabilities to continue to dress in ways that prevent or hinder them from truly integrating into their communities. Silence is it's own form of approval.

Sorry, I don't think that our dress sense (or lack thereof) is what hinders us from truly integrating into our communities.

I find the idea of other people's nastiness as essentially a "natural" form of behavior mod repugnant. It reminds me too much of the idea I heard all the time in grade school that being bullied was good for me, because it would teach me to stand out less. (It didn't, it taught me to hate myself for standing out.)

You're also assuming that if we don't look a particular way it's because we don't "know better" (because obviously it's "better" to look a certain other way, and anyone who knew the cultural standards would choose them), and need to be taught, preferably by other people being nasty and catty to us. Yes, nastiness is very powerful, but that doesn't mean it's right.

I've for instance fought for years (in some cases most of my life) to:

1. Be free from people insisting that I shave or disguise my facial or body hair because I'm a woman.

2. Be able to go out without a bra (because I find the things incredibly uncomfortable).

3. Not have to rush to somewhere private to move the ways my body naturally moves.

4. Wear clothes that are comfortable or functional for me (including functional in ways other people might not expect) without being treated like I'm either over- or under-dressed.

5. Avoid wasting energy on things like personal vanity.

Some of those things have become more important, or more impossible to avoid, over time.

I'm aware, of course, that people have their reactions to these things. I'm aware of it from (a) having it shouted at me my entire life and (b) if anyone was staring and I didn't notice, always having someone around to point out "helpfully" that "people are staring". But I've also learned that people are going to comment and/or stare no matter what I wear or how much of my body I force to conform to their standards.

But none of these things I'm doing actually damage anyone. So why do you think it's so great to hand out "natural consequences" to anyone who sticks out from some appearance-based standard? Has it occurred to you there's nothing "natural" about people becoming afraid to go outside?

I mean, cattiness in a person's head or to someone else they know is one thing, maybe not the greatest thing but at least not shouting it out to the targets of the cattiness. But justifying loud cattiness because it keeps us disabled folks in line better than any of your other "programming" could possibly do? No way, that's just an attempt to justify nasty behavior that does harm people because of its ability to instill fear in people engaging in behavior that isn't harming anyone (but that you don't personally happen to find appropriate enough).

Of course people do comment on my appearance in a positive way. Usually along the lines that it's good to see someone who isn't letting fashion tell them what to look like. I'd never meet those people if you had your way.

Anonymous said...

I too work with people with disabilities. If people with disabiities want to be treated like everyone else I guess that would include coming under the scrutiny of "People Watchers," they are everywhere. I too wonder if some people look at themselves in the mirror before going out and say to themselves "I look good." Maybe they need a new mirror. I also am a person that shops from the XL rack and shop for 1st.fit, 2nd.coverage, and 3rd.style. I never have been one that bought clothes just because someone that made a lot more money than I do said they were in style. I look in the mirror before I go out because I too am a peope watcher.

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